Truth to Power Ratio

00:01 Hey everybody, it's time once again for the program that is literally made up on the spot. Well sometimes in advance and sometimes even after the fact You know why? Because we have no agenda This is No Agenda coming to you from The Curry Manor in United Kingdom I'm Adam Curry And I'm John C. Dvorak up here in Northern California where we've had a couple of 100 degree days and now, I think it's cooling off today and I can finally see the marine layer out there beyond the Golden Gate Bridge ready to come in and cool us off Well shit if I knew you were gonna give a full weather report I would have done the same Actually, let me tell you I did just come through the clouds from the Netherlands and I just...I did some amazing instrument flying today. I've gone to a whole new level of airmanship. I'm quite jazzed and adrenalized actually

00:48 Well, that's sweet. It is because there comes this point when you have the confidence to do a number of different things and actually kind of gets easier when you get to instrument flying because all you have to do is just follow instructions and you're really managing the system instead of flying the airplane but it feels like the world... The oyster that is my world enlarged a little bit today I think I can go to more places and do more things But you're not going to take, that doesn't mean you're gonna become some sort of a crackpot risk taker. Quite the opposite no in fact there's this magical moment I think before you get your instrument rating

01:28 before you really have done instrument flying, because the thing with instrument flying and people may know this but really the main issue is if you're a private pilot and so you fly under what they call visual flying rules VFR that means you can see the ground at all times when you're flying. Because when you go into clouds let's just call that a whiteout because your completely or all the windows is just white you can't see anything At that point, if you don't know how to read your instruments and fly on your instruments... ...you will probably wind up upside down within about 7 seconds because of vertigo. And the vertigo thing or as we call it the leans is really quite interesting because when you're flying in IMC so instrument meteorological conditions

02:24 You basically have to look at your horizon and keep the aircraft level, and you don't look outside. In fact you don't even move your head very much because every movement that you make with your head could cause vertigo... I mean if you're trained in it then you recognize it and you don't do anything wrong But you still have the same feeling. It's like I feel like the aircraft is leaning to the left, where really it's leaning to the right or doing something else. It's a very weird sensation but once your past it, its pretty cool. Well good then ill feel more comfortable flying with you Would you really get on with me? You'd fly with me wouldn't ya? Yeah yeah well your safety oriented and you're not crazy

03:11 So, let's talk a little bit about No Agenda. The program No Agenda? Yeah you've heard of it. Yes surely along with some 35 thousand other people so I've been getting a lot of you know since i'm doing a lot of twittering as you do uh... I've been getting a lot of commentary regarding the concept of no agenda and what it means Oh, that's interesting. Okay. Yeah they always say well hi in fact I said on a Twitter or a tweeter whatever the hell you want to call it A tutor! A tutor earlier that i'm going to explain what no agenda means and then somebody you know uber chick I think is who it was one of my followers she says well then by doing even saying that means you have an agenda And see this so this one when I try to point out we're talking about agenda in the meta sense We're not talking about

04:04 a show that has no list of things to talk about or things that we're maybe going to discuss here and there, but by no agenda. We mean we don't have like some sort of you know at a meta-agenda like we were not trying to sell something. Not trying to get somebody in office. Were not trying to do anything it you know we're not scheming and I did my agenda in this sense I mean scheming planning plotting yeah because every first of all its entertainment every show we do is intended to entertain the audience one way or the other And I think you're right, when you do an entertainment show of course there's some planning but the thing that is interesting about this is we typically plan separately. So I have a couple things and John has a couple things but we don't discuss the topics offline but that has nothing to with agenda it just has to do with freshness in conversation

04:54 Right, we don't. Yeah and sometimes like last week I don't think either one of us had a list of anything to talk about in fact the show took a good half hour before it got off the ground and i also want to mention that because were doing it on Skype It does take more than a few minutes for two of us actually sync with the timing of talking to somebody who is out of phase Now, you know that and there's even with ISDN I think would be out of phase because... Can i just say one thing about that? Because I'm glad you brought that up. Cause a lot of..I learned a lot about ISDN and I've been working with it for the past week doing this thing for Aero Classic Rock in The Netherlands And I do that with an ISDN

05:40 connection and the delay is literally 60 milliseconds so it's it's it is like sitting next to someone there is no delay or the delay is so minimal that your brain adjusts to it within seconds. Yeah but that's the delay from there to The Netherlands, not the delay from there to California which has got to be one of the longest distances one of the longest throws for ISDN there is and I have seen these overseas Can I just say something? Go ahead. Because, because I have learned something here that delay even to California would still be minimal and the reason why...because this is what i've learned the reason why Is you are actually getting a two dedicated 64 kilobit circuits You know there's no routing There's no buffering of routers And of course there's no waiting for packets that were lost along the way So when I consider

06:31 And by the way, it's using an AAC codec. So it's kind of an open standard and available everywhere When I consider though how easy the ISDN codec makers have these boxes because of that dedicated circuit... What the guys at Skype have done coming up with maybe 600 ms, a little more than half a second And you can even hear it on the show sometimes, when one of us responds to the other usually with laughter there is just that split second delay. Sometimes I'll say something and I'm like wow! I really bombed on that joke but then the laugh will come in but still those guys at Skype have done a phenomenal job with minimizing the latency

07:20 I agree, but it would be probably if we did actually if we ever make money on this show. I'll put ISDN in and you know as long as like you know what I'm saying We'll do it that way because it would be a little better But it will only be incrementally better, but it would be better I agree because a direct shot between you and because p2p is not really P to P on the On the internet, it's like yeah. It's kind of P2P but is jumping around all over the place in the meantime right? The bottom layer... The actual packet layer is jumping around Yeah, its being passed around the way it works and But anyway I actually have a faster connection now I got my Comcast boosted

07:58 and to 16 and three, which is pretty... But when I tested it against the English servers, I was getting four and .5. Which is still better than what I was gonna have before. When did you boost this? Did we have it last week as well? No, no I got it boosted like yesterday on Friday. Okay because last week we had a show without you know knock on wood and don't invite the boogeyman in but last week we had almost a flawless connection the whole way through Yeah, I think it was because what time do we do? Much difference no. I think yeah, I think it fell apart once in that which brings me to another point well Let me finish the latency thing first because a lot of you know one of the worst kinds of latencies is these are when You see it on broadcasting with the sound Exactly one of the cheapest connections you can make It's very inexpensive to do a satellite link up and

08:52 And anyone can do it, because you could have a truck come out and put a satellite in your front yard. But the delay is unbelievably painful. That's probably one-and-a-half to two seconds Yeah, it's horrible now on to as we have some critics out there and I wanted to answer a question that came up in their discussion which is We have critics. Oh, yeah Well, I think that's a good sign because that means we have a lot of listeners And there's a lot of people at let's face it don't like either one of us but anyway But anyway, the thing is we do this show straight up. We do not stop. I've heard that too. I'm like... The coffee breaks! Now what happens now? This does happen and if you think you're hearing an edit it's for the following reason because it didn't happen last week but it might have once in a while be yacking away yakking away and then next thing you know ding the connection is dead the Skype connections dead. We re-hookup

09:54 You know without taking a break and and try to start at the exact same point where we got where we lost the connection in fact I'll even count John in on it on the thought that he's making I'll say you know Let him hear the piece or I'll say okay. This is this is the word that we're gonna edit it on Company, oh punch back in on and I'll count them down and say three two one And then I hit record and then you just pick up but pick it up literally with the same thought Right, and then people have to realize that we're not really interested in overproducing a show like this because it works the way it works. And once you start producing or I can just imagine bringing somebody in as a producer well I think you guys oughta punch it up! We should need some jingles in the middle. Or do an hour-and-a-half and say that was pretty good let's do a safety.

10:44 You know, another hour and a half. So... That was- I'm laughing John because for eight years at MTV whenever we did something on location I know there's nothing. I hated more particularly if it was an on location situation where Maybe I'd just done an even sometimes they would even call for after an interview But usually you're doing segments and then every single producer would say wow hey that was really great That was right on the money unless you sue one more for safety like what the fuck? I hate that And then some guy in this in the bootin yeah, yeah

11:21 Yeah, they picked the wrong damn exactly I was gonna say they always pick the wrong one Which is part of the reasons why? I really started to despise television for a while just did you have no control unless you literally sit on top of it and Control everything which is very tiresome Well you run into that with photography in magazines too. They'll take, they'll shoot the other say like we need a new portrait for your whatever your column and they'll shoot 1,000 photos and in there they'll be like five that are really outstanding They never picked those fight. You know you say I want one of these five they always pick some other one That's just like I don't my ears aren't that big so why are you picking this picture? So, you know how I solve that and you may have noticed so Recently a lot of requests have come in, you know been done been doing some interviews And they always say do you have a picture sometimes they really insist that they take the picture which is where it gets kind of tricky but every year

10:44 You know, another hour and a half. So... That was- I'm laughing John because for eight years at MTV whenever we did something on location I know there's nothing. I hated more particularly if it was an on location situation where Maybe I'd just done an even sometimes they would even call for after an interview But usually you're doing segments and then every single producer would say wow hey that was really great That was right on the money unless you sue one more for safety like what the fuck? I hate that And then some guy in this in the bootin yeah, yeah

11:21 Yeah, they picked the wrong damn exactly I was gonna say they always pick the wrong one Which is part of the reasons why? I really started to despise television for a while just did you have no control unless you literally sit on top of it and Control everything which is very tiresome Well you run into that with photography in magazines too. They'll take, they'll shoot the other say like we need a new portrait for your whatever your column and they'll shoot 1,000 photos and in there they'll be like five that are really outstanding They never picked those fight. You know you say I want one of these five they always pick some other one That's just like I don't my ears aren't that big so why are you picking this picture? So, you know how I solve that and you may have noticed so Recently a lot of requests have come in, you know been done been doing some interviews And they always say do you have a picture sometimes they really insist that they take the picture which is where it gets kind of tricky but every year

12:16 And my wife really got me into this we have a photographer. She's been working with 30 years he did all of her playboy pictures, and it's whatever and You know so we'll do a couple different series of pictures She'll you know she'll do hers and I'll do mine and the deal you make with the photographers look yeah? I'm gonna give these away to Normally would pay for them where we know this guy so long You know, we'll give him away to press and he gets a photo credit. He doesn't really need the money necessarily but then you have total control over it and eight out of ten times that a picture is needed for stuff like that they'll take yours? Yeah no that's true in fact I have one posted on the web when people say you didn't need to post it It's like a huge JPEG And uh...I just let them go get it But its not even one of the better ones but I had a guy who used to be same kind of photographer I always demand that they use him

13:11 It was Tom O'Brien, he used to be in Los Angeles. I can't find him now. I don't know where he went and but anyway He used to take some of the best pictures of food And he also worked for a couple other game companies But his portrait taking was unbelievable! This guy just wasn't natural it's like you take 500 pictures and they were all good And so it was then you couldn't pick one because it was like, geez this looks I look pretty good here. But anyway... It does take some time you know to do You have to work with a photographer you know? It takes little while to get a vibe going between you and it really makes a difference There's there's I think there's more to it than that and what is is I think there's a lot of not untalented photographers out there too Yeah usually when it comes down to lighting obviously thats where uh..I think the men are separated from the boys

13:59 lighting and they can't bring anything out of you. One of the guys who was in, I actually got one of the...I worked with Jim Marshall and actually became his friend he's a famous rock-and-roll photographer is when we got to Jimmy Hendrix picture of him lighting guitar all those photos are in Hard Rock in Las Vegas And Marshall's a character, if anyone knows him. I mean he's like you know mean and you know but isn't but he did us a bunch of pictures of me for micro times and the guy is such a good photographer in every which way that it's just unbelievable! He didn't even take that many pictures. He was one of these guys...I worked with the guy once who shot

14:38 I had a picture taken now again this is drive the audience nuts, but I had a picture taken at the absolute other extreme of the guy who takes 1,000 photos it was a setup shot for a giant blow up of me's to sell my first telecom book in the mid 80s and The guy shot This camera, there's the size of a house with just basically 12 inch negative. Oh yeah of course for the resolution absolutely Right and he goes in there sets the shot they put makeup on you set this way to make you smile boom bang one shot

15:16 And that one negative cost $87. Whatever it costs, I don't know but the shot was perfect! It's just the complete opposite of the guys who shoot a million and try to find...I mean i'm one of those photographers, I take a lot. My eyes fair and I do nail stuff with one shot but for the most part if you take a million pictures You got a much better chance of finding one or two really good ones. So our guy whose name was Hovert de Roos He he's been a hustle blog guy all his life, which is obviously a brand very professional and expensive camera And about three years ago. He finally purchased the digital back

15:56 Which is yeah, that's like a fifty thousand dollar thing But so you know it takes these really really high resolution but still with the hustle blot warmth and how they do what I'm not quite sure and you know And obviously you just get better results because indeed use fire off. You know we'll do 200 shots Yeah, you're gonna find something just perfect mm-hmm So how do we get to this part? How did we get to this off this track well let me just say I'll take it back a little bit and say We did edit one part last week. I was just thinking And this has happened maybe one other time before on your end my wife actually called me, and it was more than like 30 seconds you know she had there was something important She had to tell me so probably all right right phone rang yeah Right and and and so I and and you said you even said in the show Let's remember to cut that out, and I'll tell you that when I was

15:16 And that one negative cost $87. Whatever it costs, I don't know but the shot was perfect! It's just the complete opposite of the guys who shoot a million and try to find...I mean i'm one of those photographers, I take a lot. My eyes fair and I do nail stuff with one shot but for the most part if you take a million pictures You got a much better chance of finding one or two really good ones. So our guy whose name was Hovert de Roos He he's been a hustle blog guy all his life, which is obviously a brand very professional and expensive camera And about three years ago. He finally purchased the digital back

15:56 Which is yeah, that's like a fifty thousand dollar thing But so you know it takes these really really high resolution but still with the hustle blot warmth and how they do what I'm not quite sure and you know And obviously you just get better results because indeed use fire off. You know we'll do 200 shots Yeah, you're gonna find something just perfect mm-hmm So how do we get to this part? How did we get to this off this track well let me just say I'll take it back a little bit and say We did edit one part last week. I was just thinking And this has happened maybe one other time before on your end my wife actually called me, and it was more than like 30 seconds you know she had there was something important She had to tell me so probably all right right phone rang yeah Right and and and so I and and you said you even said in the show Let's remember to cut that out, and I'll tell you that when I was

16:47 preparing the show for post-compression everything to send it up, to upload it. I listened to that piece and I really thought for a second well its kind of cool to let it in but then I thought you know really like two minutes is boring so I could cut a piece out or just cut the whole piece out but that was it there's no other edits your right straight up straight through right now it's ten past eight Saturday evening where I am It's towards noon here. Yeah, so right yeah which is you know this actually we're doing the show late So there you go so so Irina Slutsky yes sent me a twit she was on those cranky geeks recently I haven't seen it in a while cool. Oh, you actually watched last week. She was actually quite good with old Malik

17:43 Anyway, when she was on so she just sent a note to me. She got her second marriage proposal out of the appearance on the show But a serious one like I really don't know I mean I would just maybe this would be some way getting more women to do this show So yeah we need more women in tech well There's definitely a shortage so anyway, so also to talk about real topics I want to go on I want to talk about this So this guy Thomas Derrick or no Dick Rick DEC RICK turns out to be Belgian, okay? so He has first sent me a note about Use of the term poo-pooing which I guess bothers the Belgians when they hear it in English And I don't know absolutely sure why but he thought oh. I know yeah you've been poopooing that you know kind of thing I know Okay, why

18:41 Because in Flemish, if we're talking about the Dutch speaking side of the country a poop is your ass. Yeah? So when you just said it pooh-poohing it sounded like assing kind of Oh okay well then he thought even saying pissing on which is a British comment I mean Americans don't say that He thought it was better, but okay well now at least I know. Anyway in the process of that I went back and forth with him on this because you know...I like saying it because its effective but he mentioned a thing he said what is the deal?

19:23 with all this kind of, there's like a bunch of news stories about George Bush went to the I guess the Knesset or is in Israel and he made this comment about appeasement to Hitler without saying anything about anyone. And I don't even know why he's saying this, but next thing you know Obama is coming off the walls going on and saying it was a direct slam at him. He's not...you know about appeasement and then Hillary came on, you know? This thing has become kind of this weird little firestorm. I said to him initially, I don't know what the big deal is one way or another. It seems as though just a bunch of political crap

20:01 going on and I don't even know why Obama volunteered. He was almost... which makes me think that maybe there's some interesting baiting, not only some... anyway let me stop for a second. Well look can i just say one thing? Because I actually had to do this appeasement To bring to a state of peace quiet ease calm or contentment to satisfy allay or relieve to yield or concede to the belligerent demands of Right, that's what it means. We have an international audience Yes now here is the deal that has been cropping up on right wing talk shows and I'm going to give you a whole overall what i believe as a reverse marketing thing going on here by the Republican party And I think its gonna be quite interesting when you hear my whole spiel Does that mean shut up Adam let me talk?

20:53 No, no. I want you to interrupt every chance when especially when I go a little bit It's it's a funny thing to say but but yeah interrupt me because i'm gonna be throwing a bunch of english stuff in here Here's what's happening one of the things that the right-wing talk show guys are doing is they've reintroduced to the american psyche neville chamberlain now Neville Chamberlain Is the guy best known and he still kind of in the history books as the guy who kind of appeased hitler on behalf of the british? Now Nobody remembers this guy and young voters definitely don't remember this guy. He was actually dead in 1940 before I was the oldest guy in the room, and he was long before I was born. And but somehow...and now that they're playing on one of the shows, I heard him actually playing a Neville Chamberlain speech

21:45 And this is, you know...this speech was from 1938 or something like that. Chamberlain died in 40 right after he was kicked out of office. He was prime minister. He was dead. Oh by the way I went into Wikipedia just to do a little shaggy dog version of this story. This is why Wikipedia's kind of funny. I'm going to read you two sentences, or actually one sentence. Two sentences from the early life of Neville Chamberlain as it's stated in Wikipedia. Listen carefully. Chamberlain was born in a house called Southbourne in the Edgbaston District of Birmingham England He was the eldest son of the second marriage of Joseph Chamberlain Lord Mayor of Birmingham and half-brother

22:37 Later, sir Austin so in other words Chamberlain was was the son of two guys It's written oh You gotta love Wikipedia. It's just it's just it's just they need an editor. It's you know We say we would say Neville Chamberlin would turn over in his grave my friends So anyway, it's just worded funny. But the way they go on it says mothers actually... Can I just say that I'm desperately searching? I can recall something some news in the UK in the past few weeks also someone referring to Neville Chamberlain so I'm trying to find that reference while you're telling this story

23:17 Yeah, okay. So Neville Chamberlain's back into the picture now I've started to think about this at first when the crick brought this up i said that it's not a big deal just the way it goes but now i'm thinking about maybe not This actually may be part of a scheme because the Republicans have done this better than anybody else which is to tag somebody with a moniker that they can't shake Flip-flopper for example with John Kerry and the idea of being an appeaser or in a you know even though it's not the world's greatest thing to stick somewhere because this kind of hoes up pizzer is an appeaser

23:57 This may be the beginning of tagging Obama with an appeaser and he seems to have taken the bait on this. Now, he's either aware that they're going to try to tag him with this and he is going to stuck with his moniker right into the election and this will have all got his in appeasers like Neville Chamberlain it's gonna take as you were being war because it has guy He may have reacted to the early salvo, which was in fact the Bush speech in Israel. He may have overreacted or he may have reacted because he was told to kill this before it got out of control but in fact because Hillary jumped on the bandwagon and shook her finger at Bush has made it actually worse. So who would Obama actually be appeasing?

24:44 Obama went on in some minor way saying that he wants to talk to the head of Iran, that guy who's name... if you're not pronouncing it every day then you'll never pronounce it. Yeah, that guy. He says it's a good thing we should be talking to bring them to the table We should be you know that kind of thing and this guy in Akhmedijad has already been associated with Hitler by the right-wingers of the US You know and he acts like a hitler too And in terms of his hatred of the jews and he wants to blow up Israel wipe him off The map and all this kind of things stuff doesn't fly but of course he really has no real power in Iran But well I know of course he didn't yeah Well we don't care about the facts

25:20 But anyway, so true. So the so by even talking about this guy is like somebody we should talk bring to the table That's an appeaser he was he did so they're trying to associate him wanting to talk to this maniac as The same as Neville Chamberlain talking to hit back with a phony baloney paper and then having the Netherlands attack the next day So this is all, and so I'm now thinking this is all part of a long-term strategy by the Republicans to get to put tag this guy with this particular moniker. And I think it's already working So, I mean this is already one strike against Obama. And I think Hillary jumped on the bandwagon because she still has high hopes of everybody bailing out at the last minute you know she can still technically get the nomination but of course neither one of these people are electable in my opinion anyway but it's going to if its starting this soon with this kind of thing now there was a appeasement tag

26:17 I can't imagine what it's going to be like three or four months from now when we get down to the wire. Obama is gonna look like a pedophile, or something...I don't know how they're gonna do it." It's interesting you say that because I understand the moniker and I understand the reference, the historical significance but as you already pointed out, let's just say anyone under 35, well under 40 for that matter, they may not even really understand what the appeaser label means. I think that's, yeah I know that's why but there's plenty of time to educate people and we got months and months in which i think the elections went five years? Anyway we got plenty of time to educate people as to what it means any is a bit and if its used in a pejorative way oh he's an appeaser even if you don't know what it means you know it's bad

27:11 You know, because it's always going to be taken as oh he is an appeaser. Oh an appeaser I don't know what that means but it doesn't sound good and that's kind of the way these things work. The Democrats have never been able to label their opponents the way the Republicans can label their opponents and make it stick And its all marketing It's a very interesting... But it's counter-marketing Its not you know the Democrats are good at old fashioned pro-active marketing to push an agenda. The Republicans are good at kind of this subtle attack marketing which is really more complicated It's really word hacking, it's like meme hacking. It's launching phrases and labels and memes I guess into the media space and getting it repeated and getting something to stick that's kinda...it's really social engineering

28:05 Yes, and they do a much better job. Now I heard a speech by Bill Moyers who's obviously talking to some group of journalists groups that write for counterculture, you know there are basic people with no money And he was talking to this group, and they're all... There was a socialist gathering is what it was actually. He was going on about how the Republicans have made all these crazy phrases and they've thrown those stuff into the public domain and just manipulating the public and we should be aware of it but you never mentions that fact that the Democrats are constantly trying to do this and they do it more often

28:44 than the Republicans do in fact. And I'll give you a couple of examples, I don't have my list here but I do have a list that I maintain by the way of these phrases and a couple of them for example that have come up recently and if you listen to them they're too intellectual And they're also to, by the way the appeasement thing is going to work even better when the peaceniks come out. You know supporting Obama it's just gonna reaffirm his base being all you know we just basically want to turn the country over to Iran. It does kind of make sense in a way although I you know so we had Hillary saying that what she say the US would certainly obliterate Iran

29:30 Yes, she was going the other... She was not gonna put a yeah. That was a smart thing for her to say I mean it's bullshit but it is a smart thing Although not very friendly thing to say let's be honest about that No, well she didn't Well she's not trying to get their vote Good point Anyway couple of the items that the Democrats have tried to come up with right after 9-11 you first saw justice not vengeance which was a little bit much. And that bumper sticker was everywhere in Berkeley and then you have more recently, I mean if you want to go back even further they tried to popularize the term and this is definitely from the Democrat side they tried to popularize the term gravitas

30:09 which was never used by a Republican ever. And it's supposed to mean, well he has gravitas and this is we have somebody who gravitas, gravitas and of course then the public voted in Bush which is hilarious. That was kind of popular word for awhile back in the 70s I have a feeling It's come and gone but it was directly attached Cuomo, the Mario Cuomo. He was the Gravitas guy that was supposed to run in 92 but he saw that Bush was going for a second term and said well you know nobody ever beats an incumbent so he didn't run Clinton won and that was the end of Cuomo But anyway he had Gravitas So now the more... Gravitas seriousness or sobriety as of conduct of speech?

30:54 Yeah, in other words he can talk without stuttering or mumbling or saying stupid things. Now the more recent one which the Democrats have also tried to promote and has gotten nowhere but it keeps cropping up and the problem with it is that sounds creepy! And I'm not even absolutely sure what it means but the term is truth-to-power Oh you must speak truth to power oh they're gonna allow truth to power truth to power and this is like I'm not even sure what it means. How would you interpret it? Truth to power, you must speak truth to power... Well first of all there should be a ratio attached to it. You know, what's your truth-to-power ratio like a drive train Now wait a minute that's gotta write that down because no one has ever come up with the truth-to-power ratio We can use it we can introduce it The truth-to-power ratio 3.2 You're rocking baby with a 3.2 TPR

31:54 TPP, TTPR or whatever. TTPR. Truth to power yeah I'm not really sure how to interpret it. What it means is that you don't surround yourself with yes men at the base level as what it's supposed...I think one of the implications but it means that you will tell like it is. take off from the 1960s. Let's, let's you know, remember how Web 2.0 is just a bunch of rewrites of everything from Web 1.0? Let's go to back to the 1960s when we were successful as a Democrat party and let's rewrite all these kinds of phrases that we used to have back then like tell it like it is

32:36 man to power. Well, it's a sentence is the phrase speak I'm just reading from some fucking website the phrase speak truth to power goes back to 1955 when the American Friends Service Committee published Speak Truth To Power A pamphlet that proposed that propose the new approach of the Cold War Cold War It's title which came to friend Milton Mayer toward the end of the week and I'm doing whatever so that's good well yeah they give me these notes nothing data point Anita Hill entitled her memoir versus sensational charges of sexual harassment against or harassment against Supreme Court nominee Clarence Thomas speaking truth to power

33:20 Hmm well sneaking in anyway, so but you'll find is all left like that. Yeah Let's do something with the truth to power ratio. That's cool. I like it yeah we have to get come up with a formula We will turn into an algorithm there you go We need it like social graph as another one my favorites. I love that too So anyway, I have a list of these and one of these days I'll discuss them in more detail. You got one more? Well you know...I probably will at the top but there's a ton of em'. Another one that they threw out there was No War for Oil or something like that. I can't remember how it is phrased exactly but that bumper sticker is all over the place trying to be a meme

34:08 Anyway, well yeah. Yeah, I mean there's a bunch of these I Like I said, I just thought about him now But the I wanted that anyway so I thank Thomas de Krik for asking it what? I thought was a stupid question but turns out to be interesting Everybody who listens to this show is on top of the appeasement thing and we'll be able to spot it as The propagandistic machine starts to grind away on poor Obama That is interesting to track Hmm well I guess the education now that what you said, you know since a lot of people. I'm and I had to look it up like appeasement Let me just look it up so let's watch out for the education process of the appeasement meme Well, I will end in hand and the read the rebirth of Neville Chamberlain That's the funny one by the way You should everyone should go take a look at that Wikipedia page on Neville Chamberlain Just to see all these photos that are in there have these British

35:05 stick in the muds and there's one after another it's unbelievable. Careful now, careful now I live over here. And we usually do everything through email, but you know we talk. I've only known the guy for a little bit because it's just been a short kind of thing he had to do for me. So I get on the phone with him and were chatting away so basically go through whatever we need to in like 45 minutes and like might as well talk with the guy for 15 minutes cause he is going to bill me for a full hour anyway right?

35:51 And so we're talking and he's interested in Mivio, what kind of stuff about my show. He also has to understand some things because believe it or not I'm one of these people that has to write down how many days I am in which fucking country to pay tax at the right place and so you just want him to understand what work is and how do we do when I'm doing something for the Netherlands from here? Or I'm doing something here for San Francisco And I said, you know what else do you for kicks man? He's like oh I'm actually a volunteer ambulance driver up here in Connecticut and that is part of the Department of Homeland Security. So I of course start laughing and launch into my whole crap trying to get into the country which has nothing to do with DHS but

36:36 And we're talking about, he says oh man I gotta tell you something really amazing. Because he is one of these guys that has a special ID card that should when Armageddon strikes then he gets to the front line for vaccinations or any necessary stuff in order to help people And there's a number of these guys in not just in ambulances, you know like services like ambulance driving but also it's well known that they're businessmen who are also part of have DHS credentials for instance supply food or whatever is necessary. He said that one weekend they were all called up and not just the ambulance drivers but a couple of the services because they needed some real manpower and turns out

37:21 What do you call it? I actually wrote down like sanitation kits. And so, they have a stockpile of warehouse of stuff that when something goes wrong then these guys know how to go get it and distribute it and they had to open up every single sanity kit He said there were thousands and removed the toothpaste because they were tainted. They were that the toothpaste that was tainted from China. Oh my goodness! And I'm thinking to myself, how in the frig can we have Department of Homeland Security being so stupid

38:02 as to put, you know stuff that you put into your body especially in the case of emergency that has been purchased from a foreign country and oh by the way China? I mean so if you want to make sure after you've dropped the bomb you kill everybody else just sell toothpaste. Wow! That's a story nobody got. That's amazing isn't it? Yeah its scooped I said, dude is it okay if i uh... Is it okay to talk about this? Yeah sure. As long as you have a lawyer that understands that type of business. Yeah well he didn't give his name and its just a fact Anyway facts are always good So um But I just think thats a huge risk A huge risk I don't know what other things they hand out The whole thing's You know what the fact of the matter is They know nothings gonna happen That stuff all gonna expire anyway And get thrown into the landfill Okay

39:03 I mean, but yeah. I agree with you. I think it's stupid can I even bit complain about something gee a surprise You know here this is it? I just was thinking about this because earlier before we started the show I called you and I use Skype I was on Skype And I hit your number on Skype in it forwards because you have call forwarding set up by the way Which people should know works amazingly well yep And it goes to your cell phone and it sounds like you're on your, I mean you sound like its an outstanding connection. Well there's only one drawback uh...and that is that does not pass on caller ID This what im getting too? Yep okay There more to than that What really weird about it Is that if you're not really picking up right away or something It goes through a message box AT&T interrupts the call

39:53 And I've gotten this a number of times. They do it not necessarily just with Skype, they do it occasionally with other systems too but I get the feeling that Skype is the reason they're doing it because they're losing their butt on the fact that Skype is doing this free call from me to you and your in England. So hold on so when you call me it forwards and if I don't answer or my phone is off uh... It doesn't go to voicemail? AT&T disconnects No, it goes to an AT&T voicemail that asks me to put your phone number in. Oh no no dude... That's just- okay I got that one. That's just me. AT&Ts roa- check this out because this has been irritating for quite a while. AT&T's roaming partner in the UK is O2 and by the way if you buy the iPhone over here comes with an O2 subscription right so they are definitely connected

40:46 That is the only network. It doesn't happen if I'm on Vodafone, it doesn't happen if I'm on 3, it doesn't happen if I'm on T-Mobile... It then it goes to, it doesn't go automatically to the voicemail. It gives you that please enter the 10 digit number blahdy blahdy blahdy blah and I also can't retrieve my voicemail through their own fricking partner here in the UK now if I change the network and I roam on a different network we get an astronomical bill so not this okay so let's go back back up a couple of notches

41:22 What I'm claiming, well this is interesting but here's the point. I am calling through a network where all these numbers and by the way it's not what you're supposed to say but my kids actually know about this too we all laugh when it comes up on TV show where the guy says keep them on line as long as you can and trace the call I've almost triangulated. You know, it's like the call all the details are in the line immediately so you don't have to trace anything but the point is and because that's bullshit but anyway The thing is they've got my number they've got two number I dialed They have a ten digit number Adele Why are they asking for me to put it in again? The only person that can't put it in is a guy who didn't dial it at all But somebody coming in through Skype. I understand what you're saying John

42:15 But I don't think it's much worse than that. They're not they're not doing that just because you're coming through Skype They do it who no matter who calls me gets that No, I've got a regular line too but on the regular and I can punch the number back in and so then It goes through but if I'm coming through Skype, I don't know what the number is So it's like a little it's a blocking factor. I mean, it's a natural. It's like itself. It's a self Generating, but you're not hearing me Who else? Who else do you call that this happens to know one only with me? Who else do you call who has Skype forwarding? I have to think about that. I don't call that many people on Skype, they'd get their calls forwarded to a cell phone So first of all...

43:00 So it is messed up because no matter who calls me with proper caller ID, if they're calling from a landline calling from the UK the United States the Netherlands wherever they're calling from. If my cell phone is on the O2 network which is the default roaming partner for AT&T in the United Kingdom you get to that freaking stupid menu where you have to enter the 10 digit number If I'm roaming on any other network here, it goes straight to voicemail the way it should. So the problem is not with...I don't believe the problem is with AT&T denying Skype They won't even...how can they even do that when there's such boneheads? They can't even make regular calls go to voicemail Of course they have all of this information! They're just fucked up! So now there has to be an agenda. I don't think there's an agenda Why would you screw your own partner

43:58 I don't know. I'm just telling you it's just annoying is that, you know, I call and if i do it on Skype... If I am doing it on a cell phone yeah, I just can, you know, It's not a problem getting the number but and I can punch in and goes to some voicemail that apparently you don't hear You have no idea how many misconfigurations take place on these networks Just uh.. you know, I travel between three countries And my also my text messages start arriving five hours late, which really pisses me off because they cost money for a reason You know that's guaranteed delivery. It's supposed to get there you're supposed to have it immediately That really pisses me off when you can't rely on that Yeah I know you've complained about this and it happened to me because once in awhile I'll get voicemail from you

44:43 You know a day late it comes in out of the blue. It says yeah, I'll be there in 10 minutes Great where was I supposed to be? Skeleton of me you know standing with my finger on the buzzer and not opening up Yeah now that's very frustrating. It's only in the UK that happens with without I've been meaning to mention that because a lot of people say I couldn't leave your voicemail You know and no matter where they're calling from Anyway, the solution is to use... Sorry to blow your conspiracy theory there. I'm not completely convinced that it's not an element of what i'm suspecting And by the way, to people who have been talking about this Yes, I am subservient most of the time to John in these conversations But he's also ten years older than I am Well nine or eight years More worldly and smarter! And I'm actually trying to learn something It's nice to be not the lead dog

45:42 Well, I'm not the lead dog. No but in this conversation feel free to patronize me Okay, I'll do that Somebody's got to do it so what you got on your no agenda list? Um... I did want to thank you For sticking up for Mevio for the company on the last twit at the very end there That was nice Oh It's because of you know one of the people was talking out of their ass behind, as it were. And it was just like you know... It's like anything else I mean if you're not in the... Of course I'm the expert at just blowing smoke about stuff that only know half of a story about but generally speaking If you do that sometimes you get to real story because people say no your completely wrong and here is what really happened and I always correct myself

46:37 Always done it by the way, so I'm yesterday. I'm standing out is hot here So I'm watching there's some kid this is a subject we have to bring up on and do a whole show about The kid is going by on a scooter with the handles. You know, it's not like a skateboard Oh a zappy one of those well skateboard and has handlebars It's got handlebars And it's got like four wheels and he's pushing in his obviously not designed to go very fast oh one Of those things it has no engine. It's just uh yeah Yeah I know He's going up the street you know at 1 tenth of a mile an hour. I mean, I could walk faster than this kid is pushing this thing okay? Yeah he's got a helmet on yeah So i'm thinking what the heck is wrong with it I mean yeah I understand the helmets are important on bicycling and some people don't wear them And you know motorcycle for sure because you can hurt yourself your head isn't something You don't want to like get damaged because as we know you can't do much without it

47:39 But come on. I mean at what point do we just wear a helmet to go shopping? I'm expecting to go to one of the stores around here and somebody pushing around a cart with a helmet on How old was he you think? A kid, he looked like he was 12 Oh well of course that's an entire generation of parents turning their kids into pussies You know, I remember when i was six years old we were visiting friends. Here's one for you...I still have a picture and I'm sure I can find it We were visiting friends in Texas, I think it was Dallas And I was completely into skateboarding Skateboarding was everything! I'm sorry, I was nine So yeah, I'm gonna go skateboarding because that is really...you know they lived

48:32 one of those very suburban type areas, you know rack housing etc. and but nice asphalt and all of a sudden I find myself on something i really had not been on having learned how to skateboard in the Netherlands and that was on a significant hill so I'm going down I'm like picking up speed I'm like holy crap at that same moment basically I was trying to occupy the same space of road as a truck. So basically I wind up wiping out, but you know completely...I had two black eyes because I fell on my nose and my elbows were fine but my knees were completely...no sorry my shins weren't...my knees were fine with my elbows completely shot. I still have gravel in my left elbow from that wipeout and that was what it was like man as kids like you got fucked up and you took a tumble and guess what? I ain't gonna do that shit on the skateboard no more

49:24 I learned my lesson good. Well, anyway so there...I think you might have something you know we my wife and i talk about this generation of pussies thing uh... I can't wait to meet her man It comes up in the conversation when we're watching, you know the British version of what I consider one of the great and i've said it before. I'll say it again one of the great management consultants Gordon Ramsey comes into these places and when he runs into this certain generation, the younger people He runs into these wimpy characters that are...that he has to yell and scream at And there's a whole generation of people

50:05 That have not there aren't used to this they have been especially in the United States where they've been raised with political correctness Well, it's dying that but it's this self-esteem crap where you're a winner, we should have sports that there's no competition. My kids went to these schools and did this and I got them out of those schools. You know there shouldn't be a winner or loser everyone is a winner the guy who came in last is the last winner this kind of thing. And it's just that you don't have to do well, you don't have to perform yourself because your important cause your a person all this kinda crap

50:42 And it's been and it results in a generation of people that don't perform very well So so this brings me to my favorite topic having just been show business bitch for my wife, which means carrying her suitcases getting her tea and keeping people out of our dressing room. Once again she had the third set or the last semi-final The next show will be the finals of Holland's Got Talent And I'm so proud of my wife because she is sitting there in the audience and you know...the show was beautiful, the lighting is beautiful and people are doing stuff You can see they've really put effort into it but I am sorry a lot of it just sucked

51:18 And she's sitting there and she just says it. We're losing the end of this semi-final where two kids, an 8 year old Chinese kid named Oscar which is a perfect name for Chinese kid... ...and a 13 year old Dutch girl who sang had a musical performance you know like some piece from a Dutch musical And, you know then the judges have to make the final decision on these two and so you had these 2 young kids sitting next to each other. You can just hear hearts breaking everywhere but they had this...and they just had to be honest and say boom kid your out go home but this is what I like about this show there are actual losers! They say im sorry you lose Go Home! Go Away!

52:05 Well, you know good try no. It's just exit a good try exit yeah And that's good there's some social value to that I feel well still you know it's still If you go back in time, let's start looking at the history of all this stuff. There used to be amateur hour shows and there used to be these kinds of shows forever because people... It's a good way to get people that work for nothing is let's face reality but anyway they used to have a thing where a guy would come out with a hook! In fact, the term give them the hook has to do with this and it wouldn't be it wasn't got kind in jet That still exists in Showtime at the Apollo The Sandman will come out with a hook if the audience booze you off the stage It's still happening right they boo you off the stage And then if you go back even further and you start looking at the history of the theater in the 1800s They used to throw stuff at this day people would come in with boxes

53:02 boxes of tomatoes usually rotten eggs because there are eggs everywhere back then cuz people had chickens and you can't eat enough that you Can't eat the eggs believe me if you have a but if I had more than three or four chickens There's no way so you bring them to the theater And if some crappy act came out, they would just pelt them with rotten cabbages and tomatoes. Is that the vaudeville days? How far back are we going? Vaudeville was one of them but actually if you go back to the 1860s there's a number of good books on this and you read about... We're talking about the regular theater where people come out and sing and dance it wasn't vaudeville per se. Vaudeville is actually kind of something that developed

52:05 Well, you know good try no. It's just exit a good try exit yeah And that's good there's some social value to that I feel well still you know it's still If you go back in time, let's start looking at the history of all this stuff. There used to be amateur hour shows and there used to be these kinds of shows forever because people... It's a good way to get people that work for nothing is let's face reality but anyway they used to have a thing where a guy would come out with a hook! In fact, the term give them the hook has to do with this and it wouldn't be it wasn't got kind in jet That still exists in Showtime at the Apollo The Sandman will come out with a hook if the audience booze you off the stage It's still happening right they boo you off the stage And then if you go back even further and you start looking at the history of the theater in the 1800s They used to throw stuff at this day people would come in with boxes

53:02 boxes of tomatoes usually rotten eggs because there are eggs everywhere back then cuz people had chickens and you can't eat enough that you Can't eat the eggs believe me if you have a but if I had more than three or four chickens There's no way so you bring them to the theater And if some crappy act came out, they would just pelt them with rotten cabbages and tomatoes. Is that the vaudeville days? How far back are we going? Vaudeville was one of them but actually if you go back to the 1860s there's a number of good books on this and you read about... We're talking about the regular theater where people come out and sing and dance it wasn't vaudeville per se. Vaudeville is actually kind of something that developed

53:45 in a out of burlesque or less which was basically Burlesque was it was it was a subcategory of the formal theater, but it was it was basic basically dirty I mean it was too... sexy, sexy, sexy. There you go John this is exactly the problem we have turning sex into dirt No actually no the problem we have is you and the political correct use of the word sexy this is not sexy! I got to go to a couple of these burlesque girls in there What do you mean sexy? It's not dirty let's call it horny A dirty comic would come out with dirty jokes and these girls were just you know they were dirty there's nothing sexy about it

54:25 Anyway, so that was not family entertainment. So they developed Burlesque, I'm sorry Vaudeville came out of that and developed down by in that Canal Street area actually is where it really started to form. You are so knowledgeable! No, I just happened to read a couple books on it. Anyway so but the thing is the regular theater where people would come out and they'd sing or they do play or something like that's where they throw this stuff! It's like going to Broadway today and watching you know Les Mis or something and then heaving a tomato at some guy with them with the mask... I mean... This is the next level in reality shows

55:03 You let the audience in on the act, but you actually really let them in on the act and you'll let them come in with rotten eggs and tomatoes. And we just take it back to those times! I would watch that show Of course you would! Specifically because I'd have the guy telling dirty jokes... ...and the tits out on stage. Heh heh! This is my kind of show Johnny So, actually a show where people got a little more involved would probably be kind of interesting. Although with today's audience we don't understand what the rules really are and some guy would bring a gun and shoot the guy that was on the stage kinda thing but yeah I think it'd be entertaining to let people have

55:41 Maybe if you limited the people to maybe one egg and maybe one cabbage and one tomato each, they could only use them... Oh yeah. You had a certain limit? Yeah, okay. Ehh.. Yeah, you don't want the guy with box of tomatoes just throwing them up there because he wants to practice his pitching And by the way studio audiences are screened They do go through metal detectors At least on any show my wife is performing on Well that's probably because you're in the audience I'm everywhere I have eyes everywhere. So anyway, yeah so that's kind of the uh... We have so much to do we have shows to start oh my gosh! I like the idea of The Tomato Show. I think that would work you know what hey

56:28 That's kind of... Especially if a guy, you get a good guy that really has a good accurate arm so you can just hit somebody right in the head. So why don't we say this could be really easy? We could do this with Mevio no problem and we can put together treatment and put together budget it doesn't have to be hugely expensive to do this and your rent out-of-place You set the ground rules and you have, you know, just invite people to come and do their act. And then either go or get something thrown at ya'. We could do it with two cameras we could a hell of lot. We can really get a lot accomplished. We definitely need a clean up crew. Details! Details... That's what interns are for.

57:13 I wrote something down here. You know, I carry my iPod touch everywhere. I love it And we'll have to see if I switch to the new iPhone with 3G when it comes out so far you will Yeah probably but I did the crack thing the zip phone hack whatever It is on the iPod touch So I can load all the all the cool applications and there's some that are actually usable Anyway, you said something on I think it was no agenda. You were talking about cameras with a GPS receiver in it so it would geo tag the pictures? Oh yeah, I was on tech five

57:49 What did I say that was? You said no agenda. I'm sorry, Tech 5 yeah and you finally... By the way which can be found at tech5 with a five dot mevio dot com And that you had always and here it is poo-pooed them until you actually found it was quite handy to have pictures and be able to place them exactly where you were when you were on your Korean trip Yeah, I thought about it for a while and I realized that you know if you don't go to like Korea every minute. And so but I'm pretty good at finding my way around but I realize that I have a lot of shots that you take if you're like me and you'd like to really... If you're traveling you just take a lot of pictures because just fun to even find something that's worth having. You shoot shoot shoot then you shoot out the window sometimes I shoot cab windows a lot I see something weird and say oh look at that now shoot

58:39 And you know, most of these pictures are just a waste. But occasionally you catch something that's pretty cool and then you sort them out and so you end up with this picture that you say wow that's pretty cool in there you see something I didn't know...I would like to go to that store that's in that picture I don't know where it is. It would be cool to have a GPS data attached to that photo so i knew exactly where the picture was taken, so I could actually go back to that spot and I couldn't really think of any real reason to have GPS data on photos until I realized that that reason I just described as a really good one." So this kind of ties into my iPod Touch and the iPhone, the new iPhone. And I was thinking the following because you know that we're going to be able to make applications for the iPhone etc. Hopefully the capability will be there

59:24 So I would presume, I could be wrong but let's say the new iPhone had GPS capability which pretty much these days if you want to make a high-end mobile phone it has to have GPS in there because that just seems to be the trend. If we actually had a GPS receiver and of course it has multimedia capabilities up popped an idea that I've had for five years at least maybe longer ever since I've been using GPS how cool would it be if you could geotag certain areas in the world. For instance, we were talking about Amsterdam and actually a couple of people took me up on the offer they emailed me and said hey I'm going to Amsterdam in the next couple weeks Could you please give me a couple cool places to go? Could you just tell me whatever you and John were talking about so it made up a little template thing and I've been sending that off to people Now wouldn't be cool If they can click on a link or have some kind of yeah a link would be easy And you download something

1:00:23 And while you're walking around Amsterdam, you're getting directions to places and when you are in the spot where for instance in front of the Anne Frank Museum. You would then hear from an MP3 which could be a really low res and it could streamed immediately I presume You could hear me saying, well right now you're standing in front of the Anne Frank house. They give you some background and I say there's probably a long freaking line there so what do you want to do is just turn 180 degrees turn around and walk up to the Rosenkracht to Ben Collins and have yourself some shawarma because...and ask for it this way until I send ya

1:01:02 And you could really put together almost like, which I loved as a kid those walking guided tours of the museum where you get the headsets and you'd walk towards an exhibit. And then you start to hear the description of that exhibit. I think you could really build something like that. And it could be community thing where you can contribute just like Google maps which of course would come into play somewhere I'm sure in this whole infrastructure I'm dreaming up You know, if someone else wants to add to the tour or add another point of interest as it's known. There could be a number of things there but the whole idea about guided audio walking tour and descriptions of places anywhere... Or you could just be walking somewhere and all of sudden get a little beep-beep-beep-beep And then click the play button and it'll be like Hi this is Peter and this where Mary and I had sex for the first time It can be all kinds of interesting things

1:01:58 I think it's a nightmare. Why? You don't think that would be interesting or useful? Yeah, no, in fact the idea is sheer genius and something that is needed except I think its like anything else if we got two you know...I'd rather have a professional rather than the guy who screwed his wife near that corner but obviously That would be in there! That's what would be in there and thats the drawback Well then don't make that, yeah but then don't make the... obviously that's just an option. That's a bolt-on I mean you could sell professional packages in fact you could take no agenda and you can take every single bit where we've talked about a restaurant talked about a place you or i have been Jesus! Yeah we'd have the No Agenda visit pack now thing is there by the way there's a really cool restaurant by The Anne Frank House

1:02:45 That is just like and I now yeah, I took one picture inside the place And that would be a cool thing to have geo tagged because I don't even remember the name of the place. I'm looking But it's like very happy. It's really Stylish you know lots of wood and fancy architecture place is it b5 flies? I don't know maybe he was cool. Oh no wait a minute. That's um that's the restaurant in the in the church tower in the Near the church, there's a big tower right to... No it's not in the tower. It's right on the street and it's got like weird-it's weird! It's a weird trendy kind of over designed architecturally interesting you know place that by the way food was good then. And people you could see walking ago the Anne Frank thing other people were in this group that you'd see friends going down the streets and bring them in and it was like tapas with what we're eating their kinda thing. Was it in the Vista Kerk maybe?

1:03:42 The Vista Church? Maybe. So anyway, the point is that if I had this system or the one you're talking about...I could be able to punch it up right now and tell people to go check it out but yeah no let's make that a company lets do it! Let's make that a company hey I hear you really good at fundraising lets do that we'll just send you out with my idea your fundraising skills John fantastic I think you should start with a patent That by the way was an inside joke Yeah, it was.

1:04:22 By the time we got the patent done, you know it's like someone else will have built the whole system. No build the patent I mean have to patented on the side while your building a system up John what i'd much rather do is I'd rather talk about The Awesome System and very much like you know podcasting I'd like to energize and incentivise people who can build that well I liked idea because it would be cool but you know its non-trivial let me say that to have it so you were, I'm walking around San Francisco and my phone beeps at me with a distinctive sound meaning that I am walking past some place that I showed some interest in or that's, that I am subscribing to like one person's feed. This almost could be a little bit like Twitter

1:05:06 Well, very good point. Now think about it a GPS has points of interest and it has points of interest by category so those systems already you know kind of pre-baked know the concept so you could have the no agenda category and that would just be points of interest or waypoints as they're sometimes known that you know would be ours. You know the... It really comes down to someone in the tools I guess to assemble and create a route or some kind of database stuff. And then, of course, some application that is constantly seeing if you're within proximity of one of these waypoints all that kind of exists John. That's not all that big I don't think that's a big deal. Yeah okay well it would be interesting to get it institutionalized to such an extreme that more than two people more than two geeks with an iPhone would subscribe to the no agenda tour of Amsterdam

1:06:05 Which is what the market would be today. This whole podcasting started with really two geeks, Adam Gury and Dave Weiner sending movie files back and forth through a RSS aggregator It took 3-4 years before even we had thought of coming up with doing shows that you know putting mp3s in regularly So by 2012 we might have something Maybe but it seems to me that the GPS thing has not new its already gone past three year point And all these little... Yeah, but that's a GPS thing. But you know we're combining it with a couple things here by the way you could also integrate RSS and subscribe to different Waypoint services come on man there is something here. There might be interesting. Yeah no I think there is something because I wouldn't mind You know when I go to some of these places for the first time you get you don't get good information from the hotels

1:07:04 You know that you don't get me. You just don't you know if you had somebody that you knew was there all the time and they put together a little tour or some or just the waypoint thing where you just if you happen to be going by it, It beeps at you and you can say oh That's interesting I should go check this out or or you know restaurant tour whatever The weed service so we know any city you're in you know would automatically start beeping when your near dealer Well, that's something you'd be interested in. In fact you could make it... Oh here comes! You can make it even better. You could have the other side. Ah this is cool so let's say if this would be a great app for the iPhone So let's just take that as an example just because we mentioned not because I really want that service although.. So let's say if you're a dealer you could have the reverse of the service and would actually broadcast your location

1:07:55 Within the category dealer and then you could be on the lookout You know, you could have your system set to automatically detect one of these people so you can find each other. All right Well, let's go to something more practical Which doesn't involve illegal activity for yourself? So well, you must do the hookers then so there you go eat Now here it is speed traps Well, Speed Trap's that so that system. Oh gee maybe this is where I was in where I got my idea for it didn't we talk about that last week? Yeah there's some speed trap stuff i don't know that we did but there's a bunch of speed trap websites and there's all kinds of speed traps. It's really inexpensive device like you know 30 pounds and you just stick it on your dashboard has batteries right plug into the cigarette lighter and then screw it

1:08:44 Put it on a cell phone, have a specific ringtone. When you're entering a city this would be very handy in the USA You're going into some little city that's loaded with speed traps The GPS thing will send an alarm to you saying slow down because your running into a speed trap Beep beep and you'd slow down and you drive through the speed trap, and then you get it all clear sign Maybe or not so exactly the point is that would work. I would subscribe to that service tomorrow Okay Would you carry an iPhone if if it was available on the iPhone because that's I think that's where it's gonna pop up first I'm you know, yeah. Yeah, I guess I could carry an iPhone if I had crap And I don't like carrying phones You know that people don't understand I don't really like being on the phone all day and all night But you don't carry a phone generally but baby listen to me. You don't need that now I carry a separate phone even with the iPhone I want a phone that just does a phone and by the way I want one I could drop in the toilet get run over by a truck and it'll still be a phone

1:09:42 Right, I use a track phone for that by the way. They should be sponsoring our show but we should call them up. Yeah well so should Cessna let's call them up too Cessna should be spot, well I don't know how many people out there would buy a Cessna that we probably. Are you kidding me? Oh, I guarantee you there's lots of people in aviation who listen to me and I betcha there are future pilots who will buy a Cessna because of me. Cessna and track phone should both be paying for this. And Apple. Fuck man! Damn man! All this missed opportunity. Yeah that'll be the day, there ya go. Wouldn't it be funny if we were sponsored by Apple

1:10:20 It would be funny. I mean, you know we don't even need to be sponsored what i would suggest and I think We're gonna have to find some way of doing this is just doing these product placement discussions As they all are No, no we do it differently as our audience grows which you know it really is going quite swiftly Just you know what are we now? This the 31st episode So at a certain point we'll just have, we'll just have a large audience. When we talk about some product, we'll just send them a bill and you see what happens. Here's your bill. You owe us like $45,000 jerks. Send them a bill for Apple they're already in the hole big time not if nothing I had to do with it. I tell you that right now but wait a minute but when we should make it fair and if we really slam a product we should send them a check

1:11:16 Ah, absolutely. See now so then we have a little fun going right and then or some equivalent of the check or something to make right whatever we think is wrong I don't know something like that Well you know i dont think we got to make right what we think is wrong if the product sucks True But maybe sending them a check will be funny. So you join our advertising club and if you're lucky we talk about your product, we send you a check. If you're unlucky we talk about your product and it can be thousands of companies most will never talk about but if we slam your product we'll send you a check

1:11:51 I like it. I like the advertising club aspect. Nice, isn't it? Yeah! It's kind of like... Yeah you have the advertising club and we'll list them for the listeners here are some people that maybe or maybe not talk about in a pro-or-con way and of course there will be some jerks out there that will track it. Well I see they talked about Apple three times and didn't say anything bad about them and uh... you know that kinda thing. We can lose credibility but I think we can do it I think we can. How much credibility do we need? That's what I say! How far must we go? Oh man, alright you got anything else John? Uh...I've got plenty but you know i think running out of time Well actually time is not that bad. What are these days? Well 72 minutes. You know I sent you the thing about the Bordeaux in a box somebody sent me on Twitter and said why don't you talk about this your wine guy what do you think about Bordeaux in a box So actually there was something that caught my eye in an article and of course like an idiot I closed it

1:12:53 Crap. Do you have it open? Do you have that article open the Bordeaux in a box article here, let me see I got it It's actually on the Twitter feed and let me just by the way anyone who wants to call the Dvorak Gate hold up hold on a second John Downloading the wine-in-a-box page just cut the Skype off for a second there home on right are you there yeah okay You gotta get a better link. I've got 16 megabits coming down on my stream. Dude, i'm about to move to London just to get a better link All three of us are so fed up with the level of service we can get and that's just because the proximity from our house to The Exchange uh...I've had a cable modem and cable on order for Virgin Media for about three months

1:13:45 I mean, they acquired a company called NTL also known in the United Kingdom as NTHel and they have not yet implemented the virgin brand of customer service as far as i'm concerned. So we're gonna just move to get a better connection Why don't you just call Branson, aren't you his friend? What's he gonna do? He's going to dig up a... He's gonna build the new exchange closer to my house. Just because he is my friend. Okay, Bordeaux and cartons are the last straw for French wine that was it By the way somebody else has sent in a topic idea per Maestri says... But wait a minute! Man killed on tracks while listening to an iPod Wait a minute I want to say something about the wine in a carton

1:14:33 The wine in the carton is one thing, but it comes with a sensory straw with four holes which are in the straw to send a spray of wine around the palate and ensure you enjoy exactly the same sensations as with a wine glass. Is technology my friend! That's technology I gotta try that Hey when I get to San Francisco which I'm sure will be in the next week or two maybe three weeks Let's have a carton of wine together with the sensory straw. I'll share a straw with you. Why don't you find, see if you can find it? You check luggage ever? Luggage? Yeah when you come over or do carry on Of course I check luggage. I carry...you know...I never...You've never seen me wear the same two clothes twice

1:15:24 That's true. You know this guy for anyone out there listening this guy has never that's why he didn't want me talking about the shirts I was having tailor-made because I wear shirts more than once I Have you know, I get him cleaned? I wash them. I put you see wrong your where everything wants No, no, I do first of all, I do not throw it out second of all, you're wrong What I actually do is I'm much better at coordinating I know exactly what outfits you've seen me in and I make sure I wear something different to keep you entertained That's not true, you know it. It is so um... Okay okay I wonder what do the Dvorak see this? Let me try a different shirt When i go on as an example when we go out to dinner yes absolutely no matter who you are whether your John C. Dvorak No, speak for yourself

1:16:14 But when I go on Cranky Geeks, and we never wear the same thing twice. Dude! I'm in show business this is what I do. You're like a woman. Okay? So anyway let's get back here. Here's that's where you went off topic on me let me just say what i was going to say Get one of the...get two of the whites Two of the white wines and two of their reds skip the one in the middle And bring so bring four these little boxes of wine Okay. And check the luggage, because you can't obviously get it through any other way and then we'll check it out at a restaurant Oh wait are we gonna drink this wine in a restaurant? Yeah! We'll go to Fringal cause they always like game for crazy things like that Okay where can I get it hold on It's called... was it Tandem is what its called? No no no Here it is, here it is Produced by Cordier

1:17:11 Metzorot met Metzor Zat mess mistress at mr. Gaza is that French a giant operation I think they're from Delgiri or something oh no which has been selling fine wine since a oh there you go so this thing from Nigeria which has been selling fine wines not Nigeria Algeria Algeria since 1886 Ah, well maybe they're French. I don't know! The 25 centilitre product called Tandem will arrive in Britain next week at the London International Wine Fair. John C. Dvorak...I'm thinking road trip! London International Wine Fair Go figure! Yeah that'd probably be good for a laugh. Photo up Anyway so they got a red, white and rosé We can skip the rosé we know that's gonna be crap And uh

1:18:08 But the straw, man. I want- maybe do you think they sell the straws separately? That would be cool! Yeah here London International Wine Fair Well excuse me See, the bad news in this article is the following. The annual wine consumption of France has fallen from 100 liters per person to 54 liters per person during the last 40 years. Nobody's even drinking in France anymore and one other country's in trouble. Why is that do you think? That's interesting. I think it's because of the Muslim influence! Really?! Well, I'm just guessing...I mean what else could it be? And that and the teetotalers which are all over the place.

1:18:47 For the visitors, the fair can be hugely beneficial. The opportunity to meet with over 1200 exhibitors from every major producing country all in one place and to taste the new vintage in a relaxed yet professional environment saves time and money! Yeah, that's what Van Expo is all about. That's just a bigger event These are for the lazy guys who can't get out of England and take it trip to the continent But anyway back to this this product so the guy I think was asking me What do you know? So I don't think these are ever bad idea It's nothing new I mean Beaujolais used to be in a can in the 70s is not too big of a deal You can still buy wine and beer bladders all throughout France. You bring your own bladder, it's a big old plastic thing and you fill it up right from the barrel and there is still wine in a box that comes out of Bordeaux from various little chateaus and so this is just taking to kind of junk wine level I'm sure this wines not that good but for something if you want just have some wine help digest your horrible lunch if you happen to be working someplace in San Francisco in a start-up

1:19:46 where there's no good restaurants, this might be a bad solution. I think you know couple of these things would be good for ya'. I think that this would potentially hit with Patricia. Maybe! It might be... That's interesting. Maybe the Dutch in general would go for this stuff. Suck it and see is the Guardian headlines about the wine. Suck it and see! Well what? That's a good headline One person complained that the problem with this, you know some snoot and I as a wine connoisseur collector not as bad as I sound.

1:20:29 but I can see some snoots saying, well you know you can't smell it in the glass and blah blah blah. You know this is wines that probably should even the red wine in this case should probably be in a refrigerator anyway and its not a wine as a beverage, its not wine as a target of affection and intellectualism where oh those nose Got the orange blossom smell here's a breeze Here's another data point for you, so this Guardian article that's titled suck it and see is from September 13th 2007 and indeed it's Talking about the straw. Oh really they didn't even have the carton then so the carton it seems was an afterthought

1:21:12 Drinking from the special straws is said to recreate the sensation of tasting wine from a glass. Quote, bringing small wine containers with straws to a party is more amusing than arriving with a bottle." Huh? How about that huh? We gotta get ahold of some of these straws I'm telling you man that's what caught my eye! I'm like... That is some awesome technology It's a hole Hey it's patented! Let's put a pinhole in this straw You know a guy patented that shit And he's got that pinhole in the straw. Now I gotta look up sensory straw. Oh shit, I should have been googling that... Sensory Straw. Tetra Pak launched Sensory Straw. Sensory Straw makes drinking fun! Yeehaw baby! Tetrapak carton ambience Sensory Straw to be launched in Australia. Sensory Straw tackles different taste buds. Oh bullshit

1:22:13 Tools for innovation making milk milk interactive They're gonna use it with milk for kids when kids take a sip the liquid flows in all four directions at the same time Tickling the kids let me get this. Hey, dude So I was just looking for sensory straw a patent right and here's what I ran across It is a different patent US Patents 6 1 2 9 to 65 beverage container with entertainment features This is interesting. Yeah, it's funny. It is funny. Now there's a... On the dairyfoods.com there was a picture that's fairly good. Not close up but its close enough that you can see this straw. It's got a knob on the end and I guess it's kind of like the only shape funny. Its kinda like the thing you get on a Pavoni cappuccino machine, the milk steamer that has holes going every which way and thats what looks like its modeled after

1:23:09 And so when you suck on this thing, and they sell all the straws with flavors in them too. Oh my god! John, oh you're not going to believe this I'm gonna say... This is a link to the... You know the Tetra Pak website? No, I mean the DairyFoods.com website Okay look at that link I'm Skyping you right now So this is the history of this company Check this out In 1890, Clemens von Bechtolsheim develops and patents takes out a patent for the first models of the so-called alpha plates which are at the very heart of a separator. Wait a minute is that is that the straw? Is that the straw technology now I'm confused No this is a deal we're talking about the DeLaval family these are guys who made centrifuges

1:23:59 So we're talking a separator machine able to continue. This is called, this is one of those continuous centrifuges that in other words you don't keep it in a single container and you can centrifuge stuff out in a process so it never stops. This is used in the wine business and other food processing. So these people look at 2003 the sensory straw concept was launched Anuga food, yeah whatever okay so they've been sitting on man can you believe it? They've been sitting on this shit and depriving it from us for five years. I have not had the pleasure of a sensory straw It's a gimmick Anyway let's get some of those straws but lets get some of those wines too we'll check it out and report back Yes definitely definitely um I think its uh I think it's important I love the picture of the kid at the top of this page Wait a minute lemme see

1:24:54 Top of which page? Of the history page that you were looking at. Okay, hold on let me go back to it... Of the Tetra Pak. Sipping a fucking big mug of wine. Not of a fuck of wine! Just this kid looks so happy. You know why because uh well actually the kids not even using the sensory straw hmm Well they missed something there Let's quit while we're still ahead, John. Yep That's a good idea All right Hey can I just say this was a fun show? I enjoyed it We learned something Yes we did! We started a couple businesses... ...We learned something and we have homework which means we have to get some of the tandem wines in a carton with the sensory straw mechanism Great technology You know the astronauts use that on space shuttle Okay Alright then

1:25:51 That's it coming to you from the curry manor in the United Kingdom. I'm Adam Curry and from Northern, California I'm John C Dvorak and we'll talk to again next week right here on no agenda