29:01 That's my point. Yet, 2011-2014 she is taking pictures with her that's my point She knew it in 2009 We knew it in 2009 It has been in the press since 2009 Well okay we knew it in 2009 and she knew it in 2009 so what? What does that got to do with being a bad actor or MI6 I didn't say that No that was what your buddy Famous Pauly said Yeah but I didn't say that I'm just going for simple stuff Let's go to Amazing Polly. most recent arrest and what comes next, we're joined by Vicki Ward, an investigative journalist who profiled Jeffrey Epstein for Vanity Fair in 2003. In a piece headlined The Talented Mr. Epstein, the magazine's editor at the time, Graydon Carter cut out the testimonies of two young women Epstein allegedly molested who had spoken to Ward on
30:04 the record, one of them underage. Ward wrote about what happened with her Epstein reporting for The Daily Beast in an article headlined I Tried to Warn You About Sleazy Billionaire Jeffrey Epstein in 2003. Welcome back to Democracy Now! It's great to have you with us Vicki. Thanks. For people who do not understand who this man is, he's referred to as billionaire hedge fund manager Jeffrey Epstein. Who is he? And what do you believe he is being charged with right now? The indictment is about to be opened. So I don't think he's a hedge fund manager. He is certainly very wealthy.
30:44 There is great mystery as to how he actually made his money. He tells people that he advises, he takes a percentage and he advises billionaires only I won't take anyone poorer than a billionaire and that he takes the cut which adds up to a lot of money this when i investigated him in 2002 really turned out to be untrue. What was interesting was that the man who claimed to have sort of taught Jeffrey many financial tricks and who claims, to this day, that Jeffrey has his money is a gentleman by the name of Steve Hoffenberg, who went to jail for 20 years for committing the biggest Ponzi scheme pre-Bernie Madoff
31:36 Okay, I never know about that so she had that uncovered which doesn't surprise me. Okay, let's go to clip two. Vicki Ward you were doing the first pieces back in 2008 how old are your twin daughters right now? Twin sons 16 years old so that is very significant because you were pregnant at the time you were doing this piece can you describe what happened to you when you wrote this piece you spoke to Jeffrey Epstein multiple times he wheeled out you know, all these important bankers and academics and financiers to talk to me. And he would call me all the time but... He would threaten me! He would talk and then he would say, you know, Vicky if I don't like this piece... You know?
32:26 Something's gonna happen to your unborn children You know and it he would sort of say in as you know lightly But uh, you know I went to the magazine's general counsel at the do actually put security on them in the NICU And when they came early He had asked me what hospital they were going to be born out. So I actually did put security on them They were born two months prematurely Well, that was kind of creepy. Yes! And so then we go to the last part where she discusses the grade in Carter incident plausible he had his girlfriend uh... gillen maxwell who very charming well-educated british sort of socialize around me is a very significant she's the daughter of robert rapswell owner of the new york daily news so good and was the one who phones this these young women's mother to reassure her how safe they would be um... and because of course that the poor mother now blames herself terribly
33:29 for what happened. And, you know I talked to there are numerous people the artist Eric Fischel was a friend of the older daughters... Couple things you want to back up where she has a town. Where's she in the timeline by the way? Okay, she's in the timeline of two girls who Epstein was assault they were younger that wanted to go to college and he was gonna pay for their college and just laying But they had to move in and do stuff to him. And Ghislaine was the salesperson who talked the moms into letting this happen. Right, but when did that happen? When did she know about it? That's all I'm curious about is that... This is right from the 2003 era Okay yeah okay so she knew back then supposedly. She has a tell I think uh-huh there's some stuff
34:24 She's in the same category again as Kitty Kelly and some of these other... Michael Wolff is in this category. Very famous kind of celebrity writers who do make, known to make stuff up. Michael Wolff has got all these Trump books a lot of the stuff is bullshit. Yes! If not all of it. But I believe that Vicky's in the same category Writer and I think her tell is the use of the word and twice in a row instead of saying and she says and and Interesting plausible. He had his gun, I think two or three times in the piece friend Galen Maxwell who very charming well-educated British sort of socialized around me it was very significant She's the daughter of Robert
35:07 So, a former owner of The New York Daily News. Yes. So, Ghislaine was the one who phoned this—these young women's mother to reassure her how safe they would be. And because, of course the poor mother now blames herself terribly for what happened. And I talked to... there were numerous people. The artist Eric Fischel was a friend of the older daughters'. They all verified they remembered these two women recounting their trauma at that time So brave we all go through this and then to suddenly find at the 11th hour that somehow Jeffrey
35:48 got to the editor of the magazine. This story was being pulled— I was told— Wait a second, he came into Condé Nast's offices? Yes. He came in. I had no—I was not told about this. He came in. He had a private meeting with the magazine's then-editor, Graydon Carter, after which I was informed that Graydon believed Jeffrey Epstein. I was told that Jeffrey Epstein had told Graydon that he was quote-unquote sensitive about And so they would be pulled from the story, so it would now be a business story. And, uh— About what? A business story. Well it was a business story that explained that Jeffrey Epstein was not who he claimed to be in his professional life but the very powerful awful stories of what happened to these women got taken out which and I'm— And these girls are they involved— So the tell is after she lies
36:48 That's the way I'm reading it. I can't say for sure one way or the other, there is some truth in whatever she is talking about For example, the Graydon Carter story itself which may be where the end comes from afterwards Yeah that's kind of what I thought It was very dubious on her part Carter is considered one of the greatest editors in history of magazines Ah well that's suspicious right there then Well, this is not susceptible to pressure. There's some reports that the story she's telling is not actually accurate and Epstein didn't show up to talk to Carter he showed up with a bunch of high-powered lawyers
37:34 Telling him look you can run this if you want but you're gonna be sued out of existence as a magazine and I don't think your bosses at vanity at Condé Nast are gonna Be too appreciative of the kind of troubles You're gonna cause if you run this piece And so much for being one of them so much for being one of the best editors. What kind of pussy editor is that? Guy who's smart Let's listen to her tell again But the very powerful, awful stories of what happened to these women got taken out. And I— And these girls, are they involved with the case that's being opened today where he is being brought into a Manhattan court? I don't know. I have heard—I have not confirmed that. One source has told me that possibly they are.
38:26 Which for me would be... 16 years later. 16 years later, because one of the things that has haunted me is that there I was trying to expose this man in 2003 and the original, the first FBI investigation The one that got neutered by Alexander Acosta didn't begin until 2006. So it's always been on my conscience that for three years he molested hundreds of sort of helpless poor women who were in no position to fight back against him. I just want to go back, because you made a pretty interesting statement that Graydon Carter is one of the great all-time magazine editors...I'm paraphrasing but that's how it came across should this guy not be hanging his head in shame for rejecting one of the biggest stories of our lifetime?
39:22 Should he not be taken down a notch or two? With his comment, no. Not necessarily because you can't run like that unless it's rock solid Well I never saw the original so i don't know well he didn't she wrote it and i wonder if it was rock solid His claim is simple The story was not rock solid And when you're an editor at that level with a magazine which is high paying magazine, I mean this is not...this is the big leagues. This is the major leagues everything has to be pretty much battened, the hatches have to be battened down. You can't put anything out there that's gonna cause trouble. So did Amy try to move this towards someone else? Did she try to pin it on Trump while she was having this conversation? Yeah it's Trump. Trump did it! I wanted to make sure... Trump was actually the editor. I want to make sure it's Democracy Now we're listening too and not some fake program. All right